Vibrators in the cellar?

[Moonlight]

Has anyone tried mounting an industrial vibrator on a fermenter to assist the yeast in settling? Or on a tank being carbonated to speed up CO2 into solution?
I see sometimes when my lager yeast has just enough CO2 on the cells to keep them barely buoyant, and just some turbulence frees them up to fall. I also think some shallow cone fermenters might give better harvests after a bit of vibration to bring stubborn cells to bottom center.
CO2 would definitely dissolve (and evolve) quicker with agitation.
I would also expect dry hop characters to be more quickly released from hops, especially whole cones with vibration.
Anyone tried it?

[crassbrauer]

What about the danger of a yeast infection brought about by the use of a vibrator...?



OK sorry, that was cheap and immature.


Seriously, I think your CO2 would tend to form larger bubbles and exit the beer. In the lab, we ultrasound yeast/beer mixtures to get the CO2 out of solution. I also don't think it'd help the lager yeast to fall out. Unlike ale yeast, they don't form groups of cells which are carried by the CO2 up to the surface, so they shouldn't be rising to the top with the excess CO2 (hence the name "bottom-fermenting"). Maybe you need some yeast with some better flocculating properties, which is determined by their DNA, not the rising CO2. Regarding the hops (dry-hopped, I assume - lager??), that might be advantageous for getting the oils distributed throughout the beer, but at what cost? Your beer would have to be really cold to retain as much CO2 in solution as possible (30 F).

[Moonlight]

CO2 will not come out of solution if the pressure in the tank is above equilibrium for that carbonation level and temperature. Example, shake a bottle of beer when capped (under pressure) and it doesn't lose carbonation, but shake it when open and, yes, the CO2 will escape.
At times my lager yeast does behave this way. Maybe just when I am in more of a rush than it is.

[crassbrauer]

Your example of the bottle applies pretty well to this example, except bottled beer's not lagering, unless you bottle condition, but it's still not the same. Shaking a bottle of beer provides energy for the CO2 to come out of solution, creating head pressure, just like raising the temperature does. Therefore, I don't think I'd want to be shaking my beer if I were lagering it. You'd have to wait a while to get the CO2 dissolved back in the beer like it was.

Anyway, lagering is all about letting the beer "rest" for a few weeks and allowing some of the finer processes of maturation to take place. This does involve yeast known as "dust yeast" (in German anyway - i.e. the ones still in solution that get filtered out). One of the many reasons for lagering beer is to get the kind of extremely fine, lacy bubbles which are not possible with a few hours in a bright tank. Also, not everything that goes on during lagering is completely understood (beer contains 3000+ compounds). I wouldn't f^¢& with it...

[rafters_brewer]

I would agree that using a tank shaker seems like a bad idea on a large scale. However, while at the hardware store I have often thought about force-carbonating beer or soda in the keg with a heavy-duty paint can shaker/mixer. I'm suprised some home brewers haven't done it yet, but maybe I didn't look hard enough...

[Valleybrew]

Brian,
How about sonic wave technology??, I thought of this many years ago. AKA hook up the subwoofer and play some serious muzak. I was reading about standing waves and sonic pressures at the time and thought it could be used to flocculate solids in a liquid system. I believe it is used in some suspended particle systems. Worst case the yeast would be groovin to some great tunes making their life and yours more enjoyable. I am in the process of some "exterior sonic passivation" on my new tanks today.
Steve

[liammckenna]

I wonder if it would improve the sex life of the yeast.

Oh my.

Pax.

Liam